Replay: Live Chat with Carne Ross

  • submit to reddit

Carne Ross joined us in a live chat and answered your questions on Tuesday, April 10. The conversation covered a lot of ground with Ross offering advice for getting involved; his thoughts about nation states; the European Union; James Joyce and anarchism; and the success of participatory, direct government at the community level. You can replay the chat by hitting the play button in the box below.

Carne Ross was a British diplomat for 15 years before leaving the foreign service to found Independent Diplomat, a nonprofit consulting firm that offers diplomatic advice to poor, politically marginalized governments and political groups, including Kosovo, Somaliland, and other NGOs and institutions. He’s written two books: Independent Diplomat: Dispatches From an Unaccountable Elite and Leaderless Revolution: How Ordinary People Will Take Power and Change Politics in the 21st Century.

  • submit to reddit

BillMoyers.com encourages conversation and debate around issues, events and ideas related to content on Moyers & Company and the BillMoyers.com website.

  • The editorial staff reserves the right to take down comments it deems inappropriate.
  • Profanity, personal attacks, hate speech, off-topic posts, advertisements and spam will not be tolerated.
  • Do not intentionally make false or misleading statements, impersonate someone else, break the law, or condone or encourage unlawful activity.

If your comments consistently or intentionally make this community a less civil and enjoyable place to be, you and your comments will be excluded from it.

We need your help with this. If you feel a post is not in line with the comment policy, please flag it so that we can take a look. Comments and questions about our policy are welcome. Please send an email to info@moyersmedia.com

Find out more about BillMoyers.com's privacy policy and terms of service.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    What is your response Carne Ross when opponents attempt to smear you by finding supposed contradictions between your personal habits and choices and the egalitarian and ecological values you espouse. (I use self-deprecational humor, myself.) Have you ever told them to mind their own business and respect your privacy? I would expect that the particulars of your recommendation to let the means model the ends come into play. I recall my Mom yelling,”Do as I say, not as I do!” I ask this question with deference, knowing how difficult living as an example can be. Maybe decorous privacy remains possible in a leaderless movement. Thank you for your observations on this.

  • Anonymous

    Who’s the last government leader you trusted and what can we do to make sure we’re electing candidates with transparency and integrity — and that they stay that way?

  • MCAV

    Mr. Ross, your voice encourages my timid feet; however, the major reason I hesitate is I’m afraid of the unpleasant change in the role of the police, the high comfort level my relatives have with joining the military (to pay for college), and my fear of guns and Kafkaesque incarceration.  

    Would you please discuss the growing role of the military abroad and of the police at home and how citizens can deal with this phenomenon.  Thank you. 

  • Jeff Rudisill

    Mr. Ross, I was getting disillusioned/burned out with even  the small amount of effort I’ve been putting into Occupy related change. Your interview with Mr. Moyers has reinvigorated me; especially the focus you bring with the 9 principles for action.
    Here are two compelling issues that are on my mind. I would appreciate your perspective.1. Since elections are primarily popularity contests, limited by the two party system, I would like us to consider choosing representatives, starting with the House, through a lottery system. Representatives chosen would spend their first 6 months in training on group decision making, ethics, fundamentals of government; i.e., learning how to be a represenative. An alternative might be to select candidates by lottery and chose each representative by popular vote from that pool. This would reduce the influence of money in government, and create a true “govt by the people” instead of govt by the politicians. Can teachers, doctors, auto mechanics, artists, etc. make decisions as well as our current system?

    2. Many of our problems are economic. We are living with a 500+ year-old economic system based on a neo-Malthusian mindset of scarcity: money as a commodity. Money has  ”evolved” into an information system; ones and zeros in a computer. With information, there is no scarcity. What’s wrong, if anything, with this perspective, and, if correct, how is this paradigm shift integrated into our culture?

    Thanks for your inspiration.

    Jeff Rudisill
    Assistant Professor, retired

  • peoplepower

     MCAV, what you say in your first sentence provides a reason your feet should start moving… in whatever direction you feel strongly about. Good luck on your journey.

  • Arnold

    Mr. Ross: The US had up until 1989 depositor owned banks: Mutual Savings Banks, Co-Operative banks, and Savings & Loan Associations.   These were forced out of existence by the commercial banks led by congressman Fernand St. Germain: Rhode Island Democrat ; whom it took out of state and area news organizations to expose and finally get out of office.  These were banks where depositors were stock holders and had to vote on management’s decisions.  We had a say in how they were run and were able to partake in a year end dividend of dividing up the profits.  Are you in favor to reviving these?

  • Rnewell

    Mr. Ross: How is what you are advocating different from Libertarianism, which basically sees government as the problem?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Ronald-Mulvaney/1704682050 Ronald Mulvaney

    Mr. Ross:  How would you eliminate the America doctrine of employment-at-will that allows employers the absolute right, outside of a very few narrow civil rights restrictions, to hire or fire.  This law is so absolutely stupid that it permitted the recent firing of 14 employees for wearing orange shirts at a Fort Lauderdale, FL, law firm.  This law could be hilarious if it weren’t so toxic as it is for the six million chronically unemployed Americans who don’t think being treated as road kill is very funny at all.  Under employment-at-will employers may legally discriminate against these disenfranchised people, crating a permanent underclass.  There was a bill introduced a year ago, H.R. 1113, that would have made such discrimination illegal under the Civil Rights Act of 1964.  But the U.S. Chamber of Commerce made sure the bill never had one hearing and so it will die.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Ronald-Mulvaney/1704682050 Ronald Mulvaney

    Perhaps Carne Ross has made a proper assessment of the U.S. government in his book “Leaderless Revolution.” The U.S. Administration, the House and Senate is so dysfunctional that it cannot correct an obvious injustice: the blatant discrimination against the chronically unemployed.  To talk to government people about the larger injustice of employment-at-will is beyond their ken.  Watch them as you speak: their eyes glaze over.

  • Rafe

    First of all, thank you for
    writing this book, it is stimulating new thoughts and the creation of infinite
    new possibilities for how future governments might be formed or transformed.

     

     

    Every time that we buy
    products or services, metrics are collected and the market adjusts to the
    demand. On a free market the demand drives the evolution of products and
    services thus the companies that thrive or banish. There are countless examples
    of how companies like Google, Facebook, etc. are collecting metrics on
    individual’s choices, likes and dislikes.

     

    Unfortunately this is
    not true of our governments. We express our opinion by voting, protesting,
    through “unbiased” surveys, or by communicating our opinions to our
    representatives. Once upon a time the media reflected the individuals’ opinions.

     

    It would be logical that
    every time we pay taxes we were able to express our opinions on how the money
    should be expended.

    Today’s technologies make
    this implementation very trivial.  By
    collecting metrics of individuals’ opinions governments could quantify the
    voice of the people and make decisions that satisfy the majority and not only
    the driving powers behind the governments.

     

    What metrics to collect?
    Agree, that is where the devil lives.

    However the common good
    could drive a list of common choices, not necessarily static by evolutionary.

    Perhaps a dozen of possibilities
    might include: education, care for the older, care for the sick, R&D on new
    sources of energy, infrastructure development & maintenance, defensive
    armaments, offensive armaments, government expenditure, health care reform,
    health care, etc.

     

    Could a proposal like
    this be implemented in our lifetimes?

     

    Regards,

     

    A concern taxpayer

     

  • Jeff

    Carne is being political in most of his answers. He states with Moyers push, he felt horrible about the innocent population of Iraq being wrongly killed by the inappropriately acting US govt. WMD’s were never the main point in US action. This was the largest mistake that Bush made. They should have tried to sway the politically driven media toward the abomination of Safam’s regime killing there own people and the assistance in groups funding terrorism. The US has now saved millions of lives and yet Moyers only states how we wronged the people of Iraq.

    I do believe Carne is correct in saying govt. cannot manage people’s lives without political involvement. The govt. needs to look into correcting regulation on private enterprise and stop wasting our money on trying to manage our lives. A few examples include our great postal service, alternative energy funding, healthcare, bailouts just to name a few big fund drainers. I believe this is what most middle of the road citizens want from their govt.

  • Jeffreyabloom

    During the interview, Mr. Ross mentioned something like “… it takes too long to become Federally chartered, so we are working with community banks … “. I suggest that Mr. Ross consider the following: If the leaderless revolution is to truly evolve past the current global financial systems and increasingly functionally undemocratic governments, each global citizen must have the opportunity to participate in direct democracy with their funds as well as their vote. How might this happen? What if the Billion global Facebook users were able to access the global equivalent of today’s bank account for financial transactions account and individually vote on the management of this non-profit global bank that is completely independent of the current international banking system AND the existing national governments? This non-violent, non-confrontational banking system alternative, that might appear to the user something like the current global PayPal system, would survive or fail not as a result of the actions of partisan government entities or special interests, but solely on its ability to serve the interests of each individual, who by their use of this alternative banking system would reaffirm their democratic vote in favor of its goals, objectives and operations with each financial transaction.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    People fired for unknown minor infractions are what corporate managers call “an object lesson.” It demonstrates the employers’ unchallenged and unrivaled power in the workplace and is intended to bring the remainder of the workforce “in line.” 
    Productivity has been increased in recent years in the USA by this and similar techniques. (Any pay or benefits increase by definition lessens productivity. So you can understand why a pro-employer/ anti-employee government would design such a metric.)

  • GradyLeeHoward

    Please move all savings to credit unions if you care about this issue.
    Then you can take out loans at said credit union.
    Close all accounts with big banks, and renegotiate mortgages and loans with  credit unions whenever possible. Be active in your credit  union membership.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    I like both your ideas whether Carne does or not.
    Your opinions are as good as his.
    I think he should agree with that egalitarian sentiment.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    Get involved in helping regulate police policy in your home community.
    Humanize your public servants.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    My answer, Jimmy Carter, and even he was quite  a liar while President, but his assessment of our national situation was honest and accurate. He has proven to be an admirable elder.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    I have for a decade posted the idea of letting taxpayers determine the uses of their levy. So I agree wholeheartedly and am glad someone else shared my insight independently.

  • GradyLeeHoward

    So is collateral killing your issue or are you advocating the “export of democracy”?
    I don’t see our forces saving very many people in Afghanistan either.
    Where is it  exactly that you think we have  saved or are saving human lives, Jeff?
    I think you need to get off that couch because Bill O’Reilly is a bloodthirsty psychiatrist. Come on  out and hunt Easter eggs with us. I’m glad “Safam” is gone too. Was he your night phantom?

  • GradyLeeHoward

    Mr. Ross: What do you think of the paucity of comments on these pages in response to the April 8th show? Are politics more hopeful in Europe? (WE are lucky to have some excellent questions for you, but I hope many more post by 1pm Tuesday.)

  • GradyLeeHoward

    My adult opinion early evolved to the conclusion that the capping of wealth and income is the underlying solution to most societal problems. On Moyers Journal we came to a consensus:
    “No one can easily become or remain extremely wealthy (and Bill Moyers himself added), or extremely poor, in a fair and just society.”  What would you recommend to bring this  about? Or do you not see egalitarian economic leveling as useful?

  • GradyLeeHoward

    He’s recommending we vex business, at least as much as the governments its agents are parasitizing and hollowing out. Libertarian Presidential candidate Ron Paul seems to focus his ire on the FED but not confront financiers, banks or other corporations. He would lessen profits from perpetual war, he claims. Most Libertarians in the USA are funded by corporate moguls through their advocacy groups and think tanks. A fully participatory government would not be one to wither away or be drowned in a bathtub. Chomsky has termed himself a Libertarian Socialist which is identified with Anarchism. Carne Ross seems  less radical than Noam Chomsky. (If not so, would he be Moyers’ guest?)

  • GradyLeeHoward

    See the latest article in “Ethics, Policy and the Environment” (a peer reviewed British journal) about human engineering. Three authors say eating meat is killing this planet, among other things. Oxytocin hormones are recommended for all persons (love drug): Talk about herd immunity! I’d like Bill Moyers to comment as well as Carne Ross on this one. It really shook me up, and I’ve been radical for many years. These three from NYU and Oxford argue that human engineering is much less risky to planetary life than geoengineering as a response to catastrophic climate change. 

  • Linda K. Kelley

    Dear Sir:  Can we change the world by using more ESOPs, having people join their dollars and expertise to buy or build companies that are owned by the employees?  Since it takes everyone from the mailroom to the boardroom to run a company.  Would this have to be done locally?  Suggestion: veterans doing manufacturing of solar panels, wind tunnels.  Could 200 people with $5,000 each put a dent in the cost of a start up?  Can the SBA give micro-loans and then use payroll deductions to supply equipment loans:?

  • Joe Bemis

    Dear Sir:  Should we vote over the internet with biometrics?

  • Bruce

    Saw your interview on PBS with Bill Moyer, how can a successful business person become involved with your passion for change. I see myself in your interview, someone who was sick and tired of following others down a rabbit hole for all the wrong reasons. You are very special please stay with it.

  • Beefield49

    What an extraordinary interview with Carne Ross. Kudos to Mr. Moyers and his Moyers & Company program. An dkudos to such a thinker of breadth such as Mr. Ross, who articulates not only the facts and perceptions of the plight of citizens but also the ability to speak with stunning resonance, creating a rich oxygen for those of us who resist the status quo and yet feel pulled by forces we feel beholden to and of which we are afraid.

  • Kerry Cubas

    Excellent ideas put forth in Bill Moyers’ interview of Carne Ross.  How do I register to participate in Tuesday’s live discussion, please?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=639805927 Wolf Braun

    I would like to suggest to Mr. Ross that along with his 9 principles (which I happen to like) that he and his working group begin to also discuss The Purpose of Government. 

    What we want our government to stand for is as important or more so than all the policies and laws that it writes and implements. CORE PURPOSE must be government’s fundamental reason for being.  Purpose isn’t everything, but it trumps everything else.  Purpose is a definitive statement about the difference we want our government  to make in the world.

  • Susan Hall Heitzman

    Hello, I am the only woman running for Congress in the new sixth district of Indiana which is 100 miles long and reaches almost 60 miles in width.  There are 18 + counties and as many population centers. There are 12 male candidates and no incumbent.     I have 6 goals  for the 6th which mesh very well with what CarneRoss is saying.  1) See this redistricting as opportunity.  2) Infuse women voters 3) Become aware of toxic nature of polarization 4) Become aware that we are being deliberately polarized 5) Eliminate the District Office and create by sharing the salary of the legislator and re configuring the paid positions –a Forum of Experience from these counties which can be electronically connected to the legislator.  Using  many retired people, experts  on a variety of issues and areas of interest from within the District it will not matter which ego is voting on legislation.   And this will serve as a training ground for the next candidate.  Representation will be within 25 miles of every constitutent and polling the district after education by someone they trust in their local community would follow.    My husband of 46 years and I live in a location where we belong to an electric cooperative, a water coooperative, a communication cooperative and we are also members of a local credit union.   Local control works!  A governance cooperative can reframe representation at least in a large rural district like this.  6) I have opted to avoid the fund raising piece.  If someone can get elected without campaign spending another barrier to democracy working will be blown out of the water.   Many are listening.  If the reality is 14 % are informed voters and 86% elect as Susan in the Sixth I am offering an obvious  gender choice  for all.  The self organizing principle that you speak of is already occuring in my candidacy.  Thank you so much for affirming where I am heading with this energy.   Any wisdom as I approach this last month of campaigning would be appreciated.  Susan Hall Heitzman from   North Vernon, IN   

  • Sheldon

    It would be a good starting point to rid ourselves of political partys. We elect you to go and represent us, but when you get there, you are told the way it is going to be, by a  party heirarchy. What’s wrong with everyone being an independant, and truely represententing their area ?

  • GradyLeeHoward

    You’re in it, just log on.

  • http://www.billmoyers.com/ AnneLBS

    Hi Kerry –

    All you need to do is show up here Tuesday at 1 pm est. You can submit questions then (or now), and Mr. Ross will answer some of them live. The full conversation will then remain here on the page in case you miss it. 

    You can also set a “reminder” for yourself above.

    Hope this helps.

  • MCAV

    To:  Concerned Taxpayers
    Professor Suzanne Mettler at Cornell University proposes we all get a receipt showing what we received from the government, not just what we paid when we pay our taxes.  Check out her new book, The Submerged State:  How Invisible Government Policies Undermine American Democracy.  

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/AMRRAGWCIZ3IWYRSWVP5MRONUQ Bon

    This response doesn’t seem particularly helpful, Grady.   I’m sure that you and Jeff disagree on many issues.  Distorting his perspective into a caricature to help support your perceptions, or mocking him for an imaginary allegiance to a television personality and for a typographical error, may make you feel better right now, but it really won’t help advance the conversation and build consensus.

  • Anonymous

    Questions for Ross Carne –

    You stated in the interview that you want to set up an
    Occupy Bank under a Federal Charter. 
    My questions are related to that statement.

    Question 1 – Federally chartered banks are members of the
    Federal Reserve System and isn’t the Federal Reserve the core problem?

    Question 2 – With question one above in mind, why do you
    want a federally chartered bank rather than a state chartered bank?

  • Ralph Innes

    I’d like an “opinion” from Carne Ross, or anyone else, for that matter.  Just one question:

    What is the single greatest threat to human life on earth, and should we confront it?

    If, in answering, you find yourself running through a “pick-list”, from Gay Marriage to Global Warming, The Price of Gas to International Terrorism, you’re dealing in symptoms, not causes, and should re-read the question.

    -  Ralph Innes

  • Tulin2252

    We need to provide an ownership title when a child is born which will guarantee that child access to all its needs and wants. It is up to the rest of the society to figure out how to monetize human existence and the life of that child to create wealth in excess of its consumption.  We should stop “educating” and leave humanity to achieve its full potential by being creative and enjoyment of life,liberty and pursuit of happiness.  The Banking function should limit its role to being an enabler of transactions. 

  • Leaping_lizard

    What intentional housing/living communities (a la Catholic Worker) are adopting these principles?  If not shared housing, then at least local community groups?  

    I’ve had experience with local environmental, back to basics living activism, but nothing with broader agenda.  Perhaps  a “leaderless” revolution really does need leaders but flat, not-very-hierarchical grass-roots boots-on-the-ground grunt workers?

    I’d love to help make a difference beyond switching from Wells Fargo/Chase to credit unions, but for same reason that I’m not an entrepreneur, fear not an organizer/facilitator either.

    Please offer some concrete suggestions for how to overcome this problem — that I’m sure others share.

  • Anonymous

    Cudos to Mr. Moyers and PBS for yet another thought-provoking program demonstrating the overt need for a rebirth of  truely Progressive organizing around a 21st century model. Participatory democracy is an idea that not only inspired the the likes of Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Paine, and James Madison in the founding of our society, it was the organizing inspiration that sparked the creation of the ‘Port Huron Statement’ by Progressive student activists in the early 1960′s.  In a recent article in The Nation magazine, Tom Hayden (one of the authors of the “Statement”), says:

    “The Port Huron call for a life and politics built on mora values as opposed to expedient politics, its condemnation of the cold war, echoed in today’s questioning of the “war on terror”; its grounding in social movements against racism and poverty; its first-ever identification of students as agents of social change; and its call to extend participatory democracy to the economic, community and foreign policy spheres–these themes constitute much of doday’s progressive sensibility.”

    We, in order to successfully proceed to improve our union, must first form a cohesive unity capable of defending such Progressive principles and progress from the entrenched societal forces that promote and popularize  ignorance and division in order to preserve control of humankind. The public good must triumph over the quest for private advantage, greed, and power.
     

  • AJS

    If men were virtuous, there would be no need of governments at all. –James Madison (1751—1836) 

    The inference that because current institutions are ineffective, that form of governance is not valid is problematic.  

    It appears that the Nine Principles mostly preach to the choir.  The ability to embrace aggregate issues is fundamentally indexed by a person’s position in Maslow’s hierarchy.  One’s concern about the environment can not take effect if clearing wood from scarce forests is the only way to farm, cook, or heat one’s home.  

    And the concern about world population has no meaning for cultures whose only option for elder care is their children.  Where there is a conflict between individual and aggregate interests, some means must exist to mediate and problem-solve for civilization to progress.  

    In the case of China, the one child per couple rule is enforced with abortions and in Greece, national borrowing has lead to austerity measures giving rise to the question of just how else can unpopular measures be taken to ward off starvation and depression when they become necessary.  

    If they can be had, I think that external regulation and auditing with increased  internal transparency and governance to rule in institutions are the best hedges against individuals’ greed and lust for power being corrupting influences.  Just because oppositional politics limits the pace of reform, the result is still preferable to anarchy.  

    After all, it would be silly for humanity to go the way of marine algae that multiply until they have consumed all the resources and wiped out the ecosystem.  It gives new meaning to the Beatitude that the meek shall inherit the earth if you think the bold will survive by colonizing other worlds.

  • Fredholden220

    Although individual action is important, I would like to know what policies and/or programs we, as politically active voters, should be encouraging our representatives to support and promote.

  • ggon it

    Bill,  More, more of the same.  You are helping to change the world!  God Bless

  • H. S. Rockwood III, Ph.D.

     

    Participatory democracy is a
    utopian concept.  Many people, perhaps
    the majority, are inert, content to live their lives in quiet desperation.  They don’t vote, they don’t participate in
    anything beyond their Lilliputian boundaries. 
    Participatory democracy requires
    participation.  How will you motivate
    them to make the complete changes in their lives so that they will commit to
    something entirely different and foreign?
     

  • 19obert63

    Hi

    I agree that Jimmy Carter has proven to be wiser as time goes by, but as
    President , he told and did some nasty things by enhancing corporate power and ‘playing innocent”in regards to our  our military involvement in Afghanistan and Panama.

    I think our last real President was Kennedy.

  • Boomerbabe128

    i agree that this is the pov that we must have to thrive:  poets & pragmatists together….

  • Guest

    Counterculturalists can’t even reframe from “CW” framing (e.g., ‘kabuki’ versus, say; “Wall Street-theatre” for some of the most egregious Obamanable $ELLOUT$); how then are we to revise Our ACTIONS against his 1% patrons?

  • Lin

    Mr.Ross has some interesting views. I think like you Mr. Ross. BUT!
    I  beleive a need of some form of leadership in this  new movement to change a broken democratic system. A system where a new government will require a jury of peers deciding who governs the country. A non-electorial system for the time. WE have outgrown the Constitutional rulers of the 1700′s. We are now educated, and we are not slaves, we need to learn where, what, and who are the people governing us, and where they stand.  We the people need to rid our system of lobbyist, long standing politicians, and the “classes”.

    WE need a real change in MEDIA. Oh! not PBS for sure.

    BANKS!
    The new banking system needs to go back to the five and dime era. I give the bank the privlege of holding my money, lending out my money, and in return there are no corporate CEO privileges. There is at least a percentage of a reasonable return for every dollar in savings.  The government receives enough taxes why tax my lousy savings I am only getting .01% on my savings?  CREDIT cards, and stocks are the downfall of the Greek Euro. Americans are just as bad. 

    Americans have been brainwashed into going to college where are the jobs, not the debts. 
    How did one get to the point where a car mechanic is making 150.00 an hour and  a doctor is getting 45.00 an hour.?

    We may all need to be making salt soon.  WWWIII here we go. AND where will the war machines be made and who will be the VANDERBILTS  from WWI; The Cheney’s of IRAQ, and AFGANISTAN.  Maybe the Germans , or Chinese will be of the new WAR MACHINE in WWIII; follow the buck.

    I have lost my democratic country: to the greedy ,the sloths, and the dummies of this country.

     STILL HOPING!
    Unfortunately, I don’t think you could answer all this, one can only hope.
    I do know if one community bank in every small town can afford to at least decrease the boards pay out and give a little to the people in the community this may start  a win win solution for all…don’t you agree.

  • Chuck in Maine

    Citizens United recognized corporations as groups of people entitled to free political speech through donations.

    Wouldn’t it be constitutional to require a vote of stockholders on what contributions are to be made in order to ensure that it really is the people who is speaking and not just some executives?

  • Chuck in Maine

    Citizens United recognized corporations as groups of people entitled to free political speech through donations.Wouldn’t it be constitutional to require a vote of stockholders on what contributions are to be made in order to ensure that it really is the people who are speaking and not just some executives?

  • Deidrelorenz

    I’m a Ron Paul supporter, and I think that he is correct in saying that the Federal Reserve needs to be abolished. What are your thoughts on this?

  • Jeff_santen

    Off The Subject a little.  But why the U.S. reluctance to assist Bahrainians  and Syrians?

  • SeastarRN

    How can we get a single payer health care program here in the US and dissolve the unhealthy connection of employment and health care as a benefit of employment?

  • http://twitter.com/_EricMosley eric mosley

    In today’s discussion, please talk about how to build an effective leaderless local direct action social change group and how to connect that group to the larger leaderless social change movement.

    Thank you!

  • Sode

    I am surprised about the fact that the people who are against the health care reform have not been asked the question whether they have health insurance. Also if they know of anyone that did not have health insurance and died because of lack of health insurance.

  • Anonymous

    You ain’t  my daddy. This is discourse, not your kitchen table.
    Jeff and I are equal here and he will respond or not as he wishes.
    Excessive etiquette is not the purpose of posting policy.
    Bourgeoisie often fixate on niceties and obscure the issues.

  • Anonymous

    mebbe so; mebbe so.
    I really wonder about the mechanism of the Elliot Spitzer sex scandal just as he was doing some good prosecutions. Reform is bigger than any  one individual. All of us are weak alone.

  • Anonymous

    Would we? It would not matter if candidate platforms remained irrelevant and narrow. It would not matter if candidates obeyed funders and mocked us for believing  their promises. Technology alone solves nothing.

  • http://www.theotherjerry.com/ Jerry Gay

    The Near Death Experience reveals we ALL go to the SAME place at the end of our learning time on earth.  Since we now understand that each of us is responsible for the actions we take to learn
    our life’s lessons… should we not act accordingly with every thought and action we create today?

    Understanding these true teachings of divinity we will now create a new way of seeing our reality.

    We are ALL brothers and sisters regardless of our race, religious, political or social perspectives.

    These individualized global realities are creating what some refer to as The Second Coming which
    in truth is a societal change where EACH of us is respectful of our own divinity and others as well.

    With this understanding added to Carne Ross’s philosophy, our New World Order is here TODAY.

  • Randolphnhorner

    As one of the principle drivers on earth for breaking the hierarchies you speak of, could you discuss: A) the role of decentralized renewable energy facilities, freeing the necessary supplies of electricity from investor owned utilities; and B) that the inability of individual communities to produce their own fossil fuel is resolved by leaving fossil-fuel-based regional electric grids to transition to local community-owned renewable energy facilities.   

  • Donna Cohen

    You said that voting is an “inconsequential” act. Would you comment more on this? Do you really think people needn’t bother to vote? I ask partly because I plan to have an Occupy class on Civics and voting is something we shall discuss. Thanks.

  • Eric M.

    Mr. Ross loathes hierarchy.  In his book, “The Origin of Wealth,” the author Eric Beinhocker shows, however, that hierarchical systems have several redeeming qualities.  Most importantly, hierarchical systems promote a large capacity for complexity (and, therefore, novel solutions) while limiting the ability of mishaps in one part of an organization to ripple violently through the entire organization.  It is clear that hierarchy can often activate inchoate human greed and lust for power, but is there some middle ground?  Can a system or organization have both the necessary complexity that allows for the emergence of novel solutions while  insulating itself from the possibility of local problems causing system-wide catastrophes?

  • ssr

    Dear Bill and Mr Ross first and foremost  THANK YOU for such great insights and for sharing them. I have two questions for Mr Ross. (1) You said that voting is an “inconsequential” act, do you mean in this current political climate, only?  (2) Could you envision our democratic system working effectively, say if money was taken out of the political system and govmt. corruption was severely punished?

  • NM

    Have you read or considered Dr. Ellen Brown’s work on healing our financial systems in her book,
    THE WEB OF DEBT?

  • Alnjo2005

    MR. Ross – can you give Americans more specifics on the tragedy currently going on in Greece and what us the root cause

  • Semavest

    How does one get involved with this project?

  • Nancy

    I feel strongly that to make the changes commented on below, we must remove corporate person-hood with a constitutional amendment.  This must be done before many of the other changes we all want can fall into place.  

  • Steve Brant

    Mr Ross, You present a very inspiring vision of a transformed global political process. I’m wondering to what end you imagine that process working towards… The ultimate aim… And, related, might that aim be in line with the vision of Dr R Buckminster Fuller?

  • http://lowenfoundation.org/index.html Frederic Lowen

    How do we address the fact that much of our problems are driven by psychological factors driving unsustainable behavior, ie unconscious motivations outside of conscious, or cognitive control?

  • Alan Gamble

     Great perspective Jerry! Thanks for sharing. Yes many, including those who follow the Baha’i Faith, believe the new world order was actually ushered in 1844-1863, although we still are experiencing a turbulent time moving from childhood through adolescence toward greater maturity.

  • Anonymous

    After reading this transcript of Carne’s chat with Moyeristas I find I have more in common with him than first thought. I was looking at his picture thinking:  ”He’s got that hep Alec Baldwin/Madmen look pegged. I wonder if in six months he’ll have embezzled all the Occupy  Bank deposits. These English upperclass guys have been coming over here and mouthing off with no accountability forever. He may be an intelligence operative sent to sabotage the movement,”  But now I admire his restraint in advocating for some sort of sophisticated egalitarian anarchy and his banking project. He gave no questioner false hope or a bum steer. This guy will focus his efforts and not extend himself beyond his abilities. He eschews celebrity and does not seek power. The thing I liked best was when he described the people who attended his group, gave a speech and then went on their way. Someone has to hang  around and do the necessary work. Carne worked diligently on his book, and showed reluctance to prescribe or predict. He committed by quitting his Foreign Service job and speaking freely. Now it would be difficult for Carne Ross to turn back. I’m curious about his special needs children. I wonder who’s backing him. He seems a genuine character like Sarah Chayes or Paul Farmer, and those are the kind of people I want to be like. See you next visit Carne. I wish you all the best.

  • SEEKER23

    We are doing this all the time regardless of how “conscious” we become. Life, thus, does not so much need to be “addressed” as lived to the practical best of one’s abilities.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/KBKKMNK7EKSCKBJAFVBXFYIKAI Kingofallclergy

    Mr. Ross please go away. We the people of the United States of America do not need you. The United Kingdom needs you more. Don’t try to convince us that our form of government is broken. Go back to your country and work to fix those problems. I will not enlighten you as to what differences there are and why. You’ve made some serious blunders of which you have admitted. Please don’t come here hi-jack the OCCUPY bunch with these marginal half truths and seek to subvert our process.  We will be fine without you. You shall not pass! The Pious Empire shall not prevail. Please fix some other state. perhaps your own. With respect as long as you are on our soil I will expose your seditious intent at every step. Please leave! kingofallclergy

  • kahtymeridiah

    Carne Ross. . Thank you for putting my dreams for peace and well being in action…..

  • Egan

    Cicero asserted:  Freedom is participation in power. 
          Freedom, dignity, duty, responsibility are all linked.  Coercion is not only the enemy of freedom.  Also it reduces the moral dimension of daily life, because virtuous behavior(e.g., helping the weak via taxation) has no moral content unless it is voluntary.
        Ross’s insight, that the Golden Rule has a sometimes serious flaw, is important.  It is fallacious to assume that everyone is like us, and that whatever treatment would please us would also please them.  As he says, “JUST ASK!”  Consult! 
        Ross’s 9 or 10 principles to achieve a leaderless revolution are profound, compassionate, and visionary — and compatible with realities, in my opinion.  I am so grateful for the unique combination of his past experience, his reasoning, his audacity, and his courage to think outside the box and humbly to encourage critical feedback.  He’s not looking for power.  The fire in his belly seems to be justice.
         Some ancient Greek allegedly said:  Justice will reign when we are as indignant over injuries to others, as we are over injuries to ourselves.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/KBKKMNK7EKSCKBJAFVBXFYIKAI Kingofallclergy

     @ Egan~ the Greeks were fascists and Elitists tricksters. They pushed superstition on the poor and the weak and then laughed at them for the same. Except for a few good ideas that they were not savey enough to follow through on, [for selfish economic reasons] their record for doing the right things at the right times were disastrously fatal; fatal to their people, culture and government. We are supposed to learn about the Greeks in school not revere them with highly pious quotes, as if! These 9 principals[with respect to Mr. Ross as a fellow human and his family, best wishes] are nothing short of half truths made up to undermine justice and real freedom. Again! Mr. Ross please go away. We the people of the United States of America do not need you. The United Kingdom needs you more. Don’t try to convince us that our form of government is broken. Go back to your country and work to fix those problems. I will not enlighten you as to what differences there are and why. You’ve made some serious blunders of which you have admitted. Please don’t come here hi-jack the OCCUPY bunch with these marginal half truths and seek to subvert our process. We will be fine without you. You shall not pass! Please fix some other state; perhaps your own. With respect as long as you are on our soil I will expose your seditious intent at every step. Likened unto an American Missionary in China. 
     The Pious Empire shall not prevail.

  • Anonymous

    Sometimes being  an outsider provides an otherwise absent but valuable perspective. Look how our homegrown peace and justice movement starting in the late 60s was easily co-opted because its movers were excessively naive and egotistical. They backed away when the National Security State played dirty too.
    I can’t see how Carne is doing any harm with  the political theater of chartering a bank. This move baits the Establishment like an enraged bull and animates it to exhaustion. This guy, if you’ve read him carefully, wants no bank; but ultimately advocates the end of banking. I like the enigma thing: That by being the perfect diplomat within the system one conspires in inevitable and abject failure of diplomacy. Only by trashing  the portfolio can a diplomat serve universal human needs. Maybe Carne is an immigrant. (And you expect him to self-deport. Is your Romney showing?)

  • Anonymous

    Nothing is permanent. We’ve tolerated excess hierarchy for centuries. It doesn’t seem to allow for the solutions needed for the worst problems now. There is no danger of hierarchy going away in the near term. Let’s moderate it a bit, OK.

  • Anonymous

    When voting is reduced to ritual non-believers violate their consciences by voting.

  • Anonymous

    True, decentralization of infrastructure diffuses power concentration and opens up access to participation and opportunity.

  • http://www.grb.net/ John Pozzi

    Hi Joe – Yes! Global Resource Bank at http://www.grb.net is a direct biometric democracy.

  • http://www.grb.net/ John Pozzi

    Hi Bruce – please review http://www.grb.net – John

  • 论文格式

    Refer to this center. Can you help something.